bash instead of csh (completely)

Stefan Miklosovic miklosovic.freebsd at
Fri Jun 4 20:54:07 UTC 2010

Hi all,

First of all, thank you for your quick answers, I really appreciate it.

I dont want to start flame war about linux vs bsd but ... :)
Before I start to explain what I want to do, I want you know
I consider freebsd faaaar away better than linux in a lot of ways.
(it is also a reason I want to build something upon bsd instead of
linux, there are so many advantages ... ok, this post isnt about that :))

In work, we try to do some kind of linux distro, it is based on slacware.
I am not a guy who lead it, but in the way we are developing it, I think it is
 bad idea at all. Firstly, we try to do minimal slackware installation
as much it is possible, so now we are about 2.6.34 kernel, minimum
kernel modules, no man or docs, files you do not need for sure are removed.
We ended with quite usable system with quite neccessary utilities. It has
about ~150 MB.

But I think with this process, we just cut ourselves from such things like
system upgrade (if slackware would have someone :D), package upgrade
(we nearly all do manually, compiling from source) and so on ...
Note that this distro is not something massively distributed, just for
our purpose,
but problems remains.

While I always inclined to *bsd and not used linux more as it was a duty, I
want to do it in bsd way. So set up minimal bsd without things I do not need
but still stay in touch with things like package system, ports (its the same)
and system upgrades / updates. I should write my own installer and so on.

What I still miss is a way how to "bend" freebsd to my needs. In
linux, it is easy
as hell, remove this, change that, and it still runs. I am afraid that
if I cut off some
parts of system, I will not benefit from it anymore. For example, I
install minimal bsd,
but it contains still things I do not need (some dir like "games" and other
stuff or some ancient groups in /etc/groups like uucp, proxy,games, dialer (???
in year 2010, who use it?) and so on.

So I am afraid to be so "brutal" to just remove it ...

FreeBSD has another philosophy than Linux, but i feel Linux is more
But understand that it is advantage and disadvantage too ...

I think I have to more study about /usr/src/ :) For example, I would
like to know,
how to install something into other dir and no to default one. Think about port.
All to /usr/local/ ... and so on. But what if I want to install it in
/ExtraStuff ? How do
I do it in "make install clean" way? Change port's make file ? no way .....

On 6/4/10, Michael Powell <nightrecon at> wrote:
> Stefan Miklosovic wrote:
>> Hi list,
>> title says it, i would like completely remove csh and install bash
>> instead. As far I know, csh is build in system, could I remove it
>> manually and install bash (of course, in reverse order :D)
>> Are there such dependencies on csh? I know that real system scripting
>> is done via /bin/sh
>> co absence of csh shell should not break system.
> Why do you feel it is necessary to completely remove csh? It is part of the
> base install of the OS and does not prevent you from installing and using
> Bash should you choose. Since these are not mutually exclusive I see no
> reason to remove csh. Just leave it be. Arbitrarily 'removing' stuff from
> the base system without relevant reason is more likely to create a problem
> where none existed previously.
> You can install Bash from ports. You should know that it is a third party
> userland application at this point. What you will find out some day when
> /usr won't mount and you're sitting in single-user mode trying to recover
> the box is bash will not be working. And if you made the mistake of changing
> root's shell to bash you will not be a happy camper.
> You are certainly free to use whatever shell you want as a user. Don't mess
> with root's shell. I saw once some highly questionable so-called
> 'benchmarking' where it was claimed that bash is 4 times slower than
> anything else. My own $.02 is the fixation on bash is more a result from
> people coming over to FreeBSD from Linux, and trying to drag Linux
> methodologies along with instead of looking at FreeBSD fresh and learning
> new stuff. While there is a lot of similarity and overlap, FreeBSD is *not*
> just another Linux distro.
> -Mike
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