kde troubles....

[Polytropon]

On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 15:16:55 -0700, Gary Kline <kline at thought.org> wrote:
> On Wed, Aug 20, 2008 at 07:26:46PM +0200, Polytropon wrote:
> > On Tue, 19 Aug 2008 19:17:25 -0700, Gary Kline <kline at thought.org> wrote:
> > > On Wed, Aug 20, 2008 at 12:59:59AM +0200, Polytropon wrote:
> > > > On Mon, 18 Aug 2008 15:36:37 -0700, Gary Kline <kline at thought.org> wrote:
> > > > > On Mon, 2008-08-18 at 03:57 +0200, Polytropon wrote:
> > > > > > On Sun, 17 Aug 2008 17:41:42 -0700, Gary Kline <kline at thought.org> wrote:
> > > > > > > On Mon, 2008-08-18 at 02:02 +0200, Polytropon wrote:
> > > > > > > > Yes, since I need to use FreeBSD 7 after an accident destroying all
> > > > > > > > my data where fsck cannot help anymore, and FreeBSD 7 and it's
> > > > > > > > software does not behave the way I think it should... :-(
> > > > > > > > 
> > > > > 
> > > > > After my Nov., 1999 disk failure, I found that my 4G tape had
> > > > > overwritten stuff; I lost 10 months of data files.  .... .
> > > > 
> > > > For me, it was July 2nd. The data is still there, but I can't
> > > > access it because the inode at the entry to my home directory
> > > > has died, and fsck_ffs says stupid things. :-)
> > > 
> > > 	Can you connect with your network in any way?  A couple years ago
> > > 	I had an "Oh no" situation where I figured everything was lost,
> > > 	but by booting single-user a network wizard somewhere nearby came
> > > 	by and moved /home, /etc/ and /usr/local/etc to my Ubuntu
> > > 	computer.  It was voodoo to me.  Still is.  Suggest to hang on to
> > > 	your drive and see if there is some net-wizard nearby you.  
> > 
> > What is a "net-wizard"? Terminology not clear to me... 
> 
> 	Sorry; my own made-up tern for someone who excels at computer
> 	networking.  Such a person who be able to figure out any
> 	networking problems very quickly.  
> 


> > I have
> > put the original defective harddisk aside and I'm toying around
> > (sadly, it isn't more than that) with a dd image of the partition.
> > Some time ago, I setup a FreeBSD 7 system on another harddisk
> > which I am using right now. So I don't have general problems,
> > it's just... all my data (programming, photography) is lost. :-(
> 
> 	If your original disk is in one piece, your data is there.

Yes, but inaccessible. I do claim "yes, it is" because I could
examine the filesystem's dd image with the fsdb tool. Furthermore,
I tried a trial version of a "Windows" recovery program under
wine. It showed that some of the files are still there.

My wish is that I get fsck to restore the hierarchy within my
home directory into lost+found/, while 1st instance entries
surely will have their (lost) names replaced by the respective
inode number, but that's no big deal (thanks to the file command).



> 	When I was running v 5.4 some years ago FBSD suddenly hit a
> 	kernel panic.  I was able to use another local server to ask for
> 	help and a network and/or kernel guy drove over, use ifconfig
> 	with a series of flags and free addresses on my 10.0.0.1 network
> 	to create a route to another server.  This, of course, in
> 	single-user mode.  Then he and I tarballed ans sent several
> 	dozens of megs to another server.  How?  I have absolutely no
> 	clue.  I had to reinstall everything from my CD set and upgrade.
> 	Then moved my saved data back over.  

Well, this is an obvious solution if you can access your data but
have problems with the system's startup. SUM is sufficient to
establish a network connection as a means to transfer the data
off the disk; another means would be to mount the disk inside
another running FreeBSD system.



> 	If your original drive is defective, it is time to get your data
> 	off and onto another drive.

The drive isn't defective. After the "surprise crash" is behaves
completely normal. But that's not interesting because I don't use
this drive, I only would access it if I needed another dd image
of the partition - it's just easier to deal with the image than
with the physical disk.


>  dd is a good move, if it works.

It does, and, most interesting, it replicates the error (the lost
inode entry) from the original partition.



>  Do
> 	you see any data transfered?

I could move all home directories (of the other users) and the 
archive directory from this partition. From the other partitions
I could copy the "important" parts of the system configuration
and "proprietary" service programs. The only thing that's not
accessible due to the defective inode entry is my own home
directory.



>  If the disk is dead, then it
> 	probably means calling a data-recovery expert.

I'm glad I don't see a need for this at the moment. Well, this
may be a strange confession, but having used FreeBSD since 4.0
should have put me into the state of being able to solve this
problem on my own, but sadly, I'm not. Too diffuse, too complicated.
Different fsck_ffs versions with different errors.



> > > 	Sometimes when I have many instantiations of kde-gnash going I
> > > 	grind to a crawl, then to a near halt.  This is with 7.0.  I
> > > 	didn't see that with 6.x.
> > 
> > I'm just using plain Opera, no "Flash" stuff at all. I can
> > open up eBay and middle-click some articles. Load goes up
> > to 100% and Opera is inresponsive, up to the point when all
> > pages have been loaded completely.
> > 
> 
> 	Have you used other browsers?  lynx or links (in graphics mode)?

They work fine. Even Firefox that is often being called to be
slower than Opera runs much faster.



> > > 	Unreal!  My first thought would be to check out your faster
> > > 	2.0GHz hardware.  I've got a CD that tests drives and said my two
> > > 	drives on the Dell (2.4GHz) were okay.
> > 
> > I cannot image this to be a drive problem (see the same stuff
> > done on the same hardware, just with different FreeBSD versions);
> > I know gcc does optimization, and that I can't compare FreeBSD 5
> > to FreeBSD 7. It's just magnitudes of time consumtion that do
> > really irritate me. But I don't mind. Runs at night, next day it's
> > done.
> > 
> > The make times _were_ of the 2 GHz P4 machine. It compiles FreeBSD 7
> > as fast as the 300 MHz P3 did with FreeBSD 5.
> 
> 
> 	This is beyond wierd.  What happens if you go back to 6.x?
> 	And use the default optimization...??

I didn't play with optimization anyway. The german -questions
list gave me advices how to do system generation correctly.

And FreeBSD 6 didn't live very long here. I used my version 5
system many years without any trouble, so I decided not to
run version 6 (except for toying around with PC-BSD) and instead
wait for 7.0 to be released. After release, I did put up a
system, but put the harddisk onto the shelf because I felt
more comfortable in my still working version 5. So I'm glad
I just had to replace the harddisk when my version 5 system
went mad.



> 	You are Win compat if you're using x86.  memtest86 is good for
> 	testing your memory.  Over on some drive sales places you'll find
> 	free disk tester.  [[I think.]]  Else, check the DOS/Win websites
> 	for downloadable CD stuff.  

I'm such a frightened guy when it comes to "Windows"; I don't
trust it further as I could throw it. :-)

Judging from the speed of the base system (general usage speed),
drives don't seem to cause the increased amount of time needed.

Diagnostic means of FreeBSD show normal operation temperatures
and voltages, memory is well, S.M.A.R.T. data is okay.



> > I should buy a new computer, shouldn't I? =^_^=
> 
> 	New? no because 5 minutes later it's out of date.

It's out of date as soon as it arrives in the shop where you can
buy it. And if you take it out of the shop, you can't return it
to get the same amount of money back that you spent to buy it.

Sometimes I miss the good old Sun and SGI systems. Yes, they were
expensive, but they lasted a man's live long. :-)



>  Look for a
> 	new-ish used model.  Used boxen are soooooooooo cheap, it just
> 	makes sence.  Buy the extended warantee, then test it for several
> 	weeks/months at extremely heavy loads.  It it hasn't broken after
> 	THAT "burn-in", you've got a winner.

Something like "while(1) make buildworld"? :-) I'm a really
really mean guy. Another box in the room and I can't move
anymore. :-)



> > > 	Your data makes no sense whatsoever!!
> > 
> > I'd like to try out what happens when I do install FreeBSD 5 again.
> > In fact, I put in a FreeBSD 5 hard disk and... wow... how fast!
> 
> 	What happens with FBSD 6.x?   FWIW, 5 or 6 can serve just fine,
> 	AFAIC. 

No problem, I can put the PC-BSD disk into my system, re-init X
and see what's happening. And I can use its fsck_ffs to see which
reason it claims to have why it won't be able to restore my data. :-)



> I think the main reason for v 7 was for the dual/quad
> 	processors ... that's only a Guess, People, so no flames, please.
> 	At any rate, the FreeBSD philosophy used to be: if version x
> 	works fine, there is no reason to move to version x+1.  

That's a thing I always admired when using FreeBSD. When new
technology is forced to be present in order to keep a working
system, I should look around if there are certain switches that
exclude the new stuff and let FreeBSD 7 behave in "the old
fashioned way", for example, no SMP (because I have none).

By the way, I've tried both ULE and the standard scheduler.
No difference.



> > > 	Please do keep me and the rest of the list up to date regarding
> > > 	your hardware problems.
> > 
> > I hope I can find out some informations with a bit mor substance
> > in order to formulate better questions that lead me to some
> > advice that will change the situation.
> > 
> > And I repeat: The maketime values are for real!
> > 
> > 
> 	I believe you, but they were just *strange*.

Yes, they ARE strange, and I simply cannot explain them, that's
what frightens me most. The newer I update the system, the longer
the compilation process takes. The system, as mentioned before,
runs fast and fine, as long as no X is involved.

Another thing that could be an explaination of the slowlyness
is the urge of the developers to put the newest GUI toolkits
onto the same functionalities. Maybe I should replace every
Gtk 2.0 based applications (here: Gimp, X-Chat, Sylpheed)
with ones using the respective Gtk 1.0 toolkits that ran so
fine on FreeBSD 5.

I would, for example, never be so stupid to try out KDE 4
on my system - there would definitely be no joy.



-- 
Polytropon
>From Magdeburg, Germany
Happy FreeBSD user since 4.0
Andra moi ennepe, Mousa, ...