Going OT: Re: BigApache for Windows - Why doesn't BSD haveaninstaller package like this ???

[Nico Meijer]

Hi DK,

Thanks for responding. Remember: tongue-in-cheek!

> Is trying to install an app a Ferrari.. gee you guys really don't understand
> how dumb point & click it is to install stuff on MS

No, you are trying to build/drive/whatever a Ferrari/liner jet/whatever 
while you don't get/comprehend the basics of the system yet. "You have 
to learn how to fall / before you learn to fly" - [was that a Paul Simon 
quote?]

Yes, I actually do know how easy it is to install stuff on MS. I also 
happen to know how much pain and agony are involved when your 
pointy-clicky app doesn't do what it is supposed to do. You're left in 
the dark, most of the times.

I also know how easy it is for *others* to install stuff on *my* Windows 
workstation without me knowing! ;-)

> I cannot remember reading a manual for ever doing stuff in MS.  Its just so
> logical & straight forward... that you can install & configure 99% of apps
> without having to ever read mans/docs/guides

Please, from now on, leave all comparisons to Windows 2000 out of this 
discussion and you'll get the/my/whatever point. My Sinclair ZX81 runs 
an OS, my MSX 1 and 2 machines (don't have those anymore :-( ) run an 
OS. None of 'em are like Windows 2000. It would be totally daft for me 
to compare these OS's. Agreed, both Windows 2000 and FreeBSD are "modern 
day operating systems".

That doesn't mean, however, that they should act and feel the same way. 
You would like that, but that's just your opinion and what you 
specifically want.

> The point I was making was at one point or another, they all came from the same
> BSD tree...

I'll let you figure that out for yourself:
http://www.levenez.com/unix/

> I am curious, how does a gui get in your way ??

Windows:
1. Start
2. Programs
3. Accessories
4. Notepad

(Yes, I could create a shortcut on the Desktop.)

CLI:
1. nano -w [file]

(Yes, I happen to like nano.)

Remember: *I* find that the GUI gets in *my* way. Not "everybody's" or 
"your" way.

> Thank GOD someone actually can see this :-O

Ohw, that was an obvious one. ;-) Windows was created to perform desktop 
tasks so it has to run snappy at that and most of the time it does.

> Windows 2000 doesn't get in my way, never crashes...

Good for you. Windows 2000 is a major step ahead compared to any other 
version of Windows before that. Still, after 18 months of heavy usage 
(Macromedia stuff, Adobe stuff) I need to reinstall pronto.

> ...I too can log in using VNC & see my desktop :)

And not use your 'puter for anything else. Thanks, but no thanks. I can 
have 20 people use my desktop simultaneously without a hickup. I happen 
to like that.

> Automount is insecure... not for a home workstation.... thats just exaggerating

No, that's a difference of opinion.

> Ease of use is not why the world of computing is a shitty place... its the
> 'genuine' lack of alternatives...

Somehow, somewhere, marketing people and a bunch of programmers decided 
that a computer should be usable by anyone, anytime with their brain 
switched off. Hence, I declare "shitty state", for I am confronted with 
the rubble on a day to day basis just as a lot of people on this list, I 
presume.

People all over the world have been happy running Unix workstations, Mac 
workstations and whatnot. It is sad to see a marketing department so 
shrewd, that even elderly people who had no computer at all ran to the 
nearest software retailer to buy a copy of Windows 95 because they were 
made to believe they needed it.

> No! - why, do you have only ONE finger ??

I'm sorry. How is having 5 'buttons' "easier" than having one button? 
Ahw, forget it.

> Freedom is nice... how about throwing me a line & create a default install so I
> don't need to waste so much time configuring & messing around ??

No. You do that.

> No, only Java, Linux & Apple & all versions of Windows except 2000 - I actually
> like BSD... or at least I am trying too.... its just that the 'skanky hoe' is a
> bit ugly & is in need of a makerover!

I am truly sorry you do not seem to get it. I feel your opinions are in 
the way of your comprehension.

I think you might want to try running something like Mandrake or Xandros 
first.

Good luck to you... Nico

P.S. Should I feel the urge to add another note to this discussion, I'll 
refrain from making any comparisons to Windows (2000). I don't feel the 
discussion is served by these comparisons.