portmaster, portupgrade, etc

Chris H bsd-lists at bsdforge.com
Thu Oct 5 23:11:29 UTC 2017

On Thu, 5 Oct 2017 22:59:31 +0000 Grzegorz Junka <list1 at gjunka.com> wrote

> On 05/10/2017 22:15, Chris H wrote:
> > On Thu, 5 Oct 2017 20:27:19 +0000 Grzegorz Junka <list1 at gjunka.com> wrote
> >
> >> On 05/10/2017 19:54, Baho Utot wrote:
> >>>
> >>> On 10/04/17 16:39, Ernie Luzar wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> Here's my take on that.
> >>>>
> >>>> The future direction has already been decided by the FreeBSD leaders
> >>>> 2 years ago with their development of a better pkg system.
> >>>>
> >>> [putolin]
> >>>
> >>>> Don't let the few old school die hearts who are afraid of any change
> >>>> and make the most noise influence you. There will always be edge case
> >>>> user who think their needs out weight what is best for the group.
> >>> So what you are really saying is Go to hell old farts we don't need
> >>> you here.  We are not going to listen to you as you are too old to
> >>> know anything.  You are old and stupid.
> >>>
> >>> It is looking like I will need to move away from FreeBSD if that is
> >>> really what is being accomplished here.
> >> But do those old farts have anything interesting to say or they are just
> >> making noise? What's the alternative to the proposed direction?\
> > This is an *extremely* difficult question to answer, and these discussions
> > come up all too often. The short answer is; shut up and code! -- Meaning;
> > since FreeBSD exists, and grows because of those whom are willing to
> > produce code to accomplish it. Those who put their code, where their
> > mouth is, will be the deciding vote. :)
> > I'm not always loving it. But it is, what it is, and it's hard to argue
> > with it. No? :)
> Yes and no. You are absolutely right that those able to code will have 
> an advantage over those who just shout at others but do nothing, even if 
> those who code don't do exactly what those who shout would like them to 
> do. But that's shortsighted. There are better ways of spending time than 
> developing something that no one else is going to use.
> FreeBSD exists for its users. This doesn't mean those who shout the 
> loudest or those with esoteric needs that no one has time to cater for. 
> This means the 90% who are not even subscribed to this list or the 99% 
> who have never expressed their opinion about the direction FreeBSD 
> should take either on this list or anywhere else (the silent majority).
> They vote for the proposed direction either by adopting FreeBSD and 
> spreading the word around, or by abandoning it and moving to other 
> systems without expressing any complaints. That's the reality.
> Now, from that perspective it doesn't really matter if portmaster is 
> maintained or not. What does matter is if the proposed changes to pkg 
> and the ports system are going to make the life of an average user 
> easier or not. Everything else should be secondary.
Like I said; I'm not always loving it.
and I'm not attempting to argue with you. :)
But in the end. Those who put their code where their mouth is,
almost always win the argument.
Tho, when /enough/ non-coders speak up. That can also make a
difference too. :)

> GrzegorzJ
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