The Website

[Ed Stover]

You can get them to run FreeBSD on every server inhouse, all you have to
do is ;
	1> Show them all the advantages FreeBSD has to offer
	2> Show them the money that could be saved
	3> Let the management think that the conversion was there idea
	4> Allow management the take all the credit when you have stable
	servers. 
On Tue, 2004-03-30 at 09:08, John Von Essen wrote:
> Bam....
> 
> You just hit it with the Linux note. If I propose to use FreeBSD on our
> production web pool, I'll get shot down.
> 
> However, I can easily convince management to convert to Linux!!! In their
> minds linux is more mature and stable then this FreeBSD thing that they
> never heard of.
> 
> Its sad but true... I dont think a new .com site will change everything,
> but it would definitely help. As for volunteering, web design aint my
> thing. But, it might help if the core team opened up the possibility of a
> new .com site in a more formal manner. I mean, more then just saying, go
> make a site, show it to us, and then we'll think about it.
> 
> -john
> 
> On Tue, 30 Mar 2004, dereck wrote:
> 
> > John,
> > 1. I agree with you that it is hard to get management to accept FreeBSD
> > - perception is poor, though I'm not quite sure why.
> >
> > 2. I disagree that the website is to blame.  I think it could use work,
> > but as far as OSS software goes, it is pretty solid.  (The search sucks,
> > though :-) .)  However, if you can do an alternative one there will be
> > ways to get the people to use it.  I for one encourage you to work on an
> > alternative if you have time.
> >
> > 3. You management uses Solaris (!) - count your blessings.  It could be
> > FAR FAR worse!!!  From my experience with [shall remain unnamed] *NIXES
> > I'd rather deal with Solaris than any others apart from *BSD.  But if
> > your management moves to Linux, get another job :-).
> >
> > best,
> > dereck
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Tue, 2004-03-30 at 10:26, John Von Essen wrote:
> > > This is an interesting point. Alot of big companies use FreeBSD, but under
> > > the following conditions:
> > >
> > > 1. The lead/senior sysadmins are old FreeBSD guru's
> > > 2. The systems that have FreeBSD installed are low-profile and can't be
> > > easily spotted (audited).
> > > 3. Management has loose control over their employees
> > >
> > > I am working for a large insurance company right now. Because, I love
> > > FreeBSD, I have made an attempt to "slip" FreeBSD into the network - on
> > > some backend mail servers, intranet web servers, etc.,. However, I still
> > > have no chance of getting FreeBSD into, say, our production web server
> > > pool. Management is brain-washed and all they know is Solaris, Solaris,
> > > Solaris, IBM, IBM, IBM.
> > >
> > > And... It doesn't help when they go to freebsd.org. It makes FreeBSD seem
> > > NON-enterprise. Personally, i think the site is fine, but Im a tech, not
> > > a CTO. Maybe, freebsd.com can be redesigned have a suse.com or redhat.com
> > > look-n-feel, and freebsd.org can retain - the developer community
> > > look-n-feel.
> > >
> > > -john
> > >
> > > On Tue, 30 Mar 2004, Devon H. O'Dell wrote:
> > >
> > > > Paul Robinson wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > [snip; poor formatting]
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Well, this is the problem FreeBSD generally has. A lot of people would
> > > > > actually like to see more developers move to FreeBSD and contribute to
> > > > > the project. It then follows that as the "product" improves, we are able
> > > > > to see a rise in the number of users. Pedantic, yes, but I'm becoming
> > > > > less convinced of the need for us to get FreeBSD onto the family PC. I
> > > > > would like to see it on a lot more developer's desks though.
> > > >
> > > > And in more companies. FreeBSD is already used by many (large) companies
> > > > (including those in the Fortune 500). I know that even MS uses FreeBSD
> > > > for the SFU software.
> > > >
> > > > > [snip; poor formatting]
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Won't you expect the competition's product to be a better alternative to
> > > > > the one you currently use? Do you honestly believe that OS choice is
> > > > > dependent on what the website looks like? If so, how did Mandrake ever
> > > > > take off?
> > > >
> > > > I have to agree here.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > > [snip; poor formatting]
> > > > >>	the moment it looks like a three column url listing with no
> > > > >>	really strong visual cues to things important to capturing,
> > > > >>	converting, and supporting new users.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Well, you know what the answer is then, don't you? You can grab the
> > > > > source, talk to the web team, produce a better version. Remember it has
> > > > > to be readable in text browsers, conform to WAI and Internationalisation
> > > > > standards and everyone has to agree by mutual consent it's a better
> > > > > design than the existing one.
> > > >
> > > > AMEN. This is a bikeshed that gets discussed every 6 or so months.
> > > > Search advocacy@, doc@ and any number of other mailing lists for the
> > > > amount of complaints about the webpage. As per the  suggestion always
> > > > posted that the FreeBSD page is too ``simple,'' my answer remains:
> > > >
> > > > http://www.google.com
> > > > http://www.sun.com
> > > >
> > > > Simple, huh?
> > > >
> > > > As I stated on your other thread regarding the post on the ZDNet.au
> > > > site; if you can't put up, shut up. I say that in a coarse manner not to
> > > > be obtuse, but to discourage you and others from continuing with a
> > > > bikeshed that nobody seems to care to fix. If you want to make a new
> > > > site for FreeBSD, make a template, see what you can do, but don't expect
> > > > it to be used.
> > > >
> > > > > [snip]
> > > >
> > > > Kind regards,
> > > >
> > > > Devon H. O'Dell
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > freebsd-advocacy at freebsd.org mailing list
> > > > http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-advocacy
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> > > >
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> >
> >
> >
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