svn commit: r334617 - in head: . etc

[Bryan Drewery]

> On Jun 6, 2018, at 16:35, Rodney W. Grimes <freebsd at pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> wrote:
> 
> 
>> On Wed, Jun 6, 2018, at 12:33 PM, Rodney W. Grimes wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> On Tue, Jun 5, 2018, at 1:28 PM, Konstantin Belousov wrote:
>>>>>> On Wed, Jun 06, 2018 at 01:39:00AM +0700, Eugene Grosbein wrote:
>>>>>> 06.06.2018 1:26, Konstantin Belousov wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> I find it often very useful to do
>>>>>>>>> (cd src/etc/rc.d && make install)
>>>>>>>>> Same for defaults and several other directories which in fact
>>>>>>>>> contains> > >>> non-editable content.  Is this planned to keep working ?
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> The short answer is, no.  All rc.d scripts get moved to the src
>>>>>>>> of the program they start.> > >>
>>>>>>>> That said, if there is a big need for this, we can see about
>>>>>>>> options to keep them working.> > >>
>>>>>>>> What are you trying to accomplish when you do this?  Just verify
>>>>>>>> the rc.d scripts match your src tree?> > >
>>>>>>> I avoid mergemaster/etcupdate and whatever else. rc.d and /etc/rc,> > > /etc/rc.subr /etc/rc.network are not suitable to etc, they are
>>>>>>> binaries> > > provided by the project not for the user editing.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> When upgrading the host, esp. on HEAD, i usually refresh scripts
>>>>>>> by this> > > procedure and avoid any editing and implied conflict resolution
>>>>>>> for real> > > configs.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Not being able to easily install clean copies of these scripts
>>>>>>> would> > > be very inconvenient and time consuming.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> I found that "mergemaster -iFUP" deals with unchanged files
>>>>>> including mentioned rc* scripts just fine.> > That is, it automatically refreshes unchanged files without any
>>>>>> silly questions just for change of $FreeBSD$.>
>>>>> No, you missed the point.  Whatever nice is the handling of
>>>>> unchanged files,> use of mergemaster forces me to handle changed files, which is exactly> what I do not want/need to do.  Yes, I update crashboxes very
>>>>> often, and> I want to get all new code, including the startup scripts, when
>>>>> I update.
>>>> The startup scripts will be installed as part of installworld.
>>> 
>>> So each installworld would wipe over the top of any localmod /etc/rc.d/ 
>>> and other stuff
>>> that mght exist?
>>> One of the reasons that etc/Makefile is detached from Installword is so 
>>> that
>>> /etc does not get perturbuted unless specifically requested.
>> 
>> Yes, this is by design.
> 
> This is going to have a great amount of push back, and this is by your NEW design,
> the existing design does not cause this pain.
> 

This is my position as well. Some people may not like or agree that rc scripts are user modifiable but they are and have been “forever”. The fact that tools like mergemaster have handled merging of them, “forever”, makes this a huge POLA violation to suddenly be replacing them. I don’t see any benefits at all except to pissoff users.

Some of these planned changes for etc feel over zealous and under thought out or discussed.

Whatever people think about these topics we must consider POLA and not regressing people’s workflows for no benefit other than draconian ideals about what a user is allowed to modify.

>> 
>> If people need custom tweaks for that stuff they should be upstreamed or moved into /usr/local/etc/rc.d as a custom startup script.
> 
> I doubt very much this is a practical solution.  I have changes that I doubt
> belong in FreeBSD, and are not restricted to etc/rc.d.   And from reading
> this thread thus far so do others.
> 
> 
> -- 
> Rod Grimes                                                 rgrimes at freebsd.org
>