Deorbiting i386 (was: Re: svn commit: r333388 - in head: . share/man/man4 sys/confsys/dev/nxge sys/modules sys/modules/nxge tools/kerneldoc/subsys tools/toolstools/tools/nxge usr.sbin/bsdconfig/share)

[Brooks Davis]

On Wed, May 23, 2018 at 03:18:59PM -0700, Cy Schubert wrote:
> In message <20180523202228.GC58848 at spindle.one-eyed-alien.net>, Brooks 
> Davis wr
> ites:
> > 
> >
> > --QRj9sO5tAVLaXnSD
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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> >
> > On Thu, May 24, 2018 at 02:53:16AM +0700, Eugene Grosbein wrote:
> > > 24.05.2018 2:30, Cy Schubert wrote:
> > >=20
> > > > Except for old computers and old software that segfaults on 64-bit, how=
> >  many people still use i386?
> > > >=20
> > > > Full disclosure: I'd like to see i386 deorbited before I retire.
> > >=20
> > > Plese don't. I routinely use FreeBSD11/i386 for cheap VPS hosts having le=
> > ss than 2G memory
> > > because amd64 has noticeable overhead. I even have ZFS-only i386 VPS, her=
> > e is live example with 1G only:
> > >=20
> > > Mem: 10M Active, 69M Inact, 230M Wired, 685M Free
> > > ARC: 75M Total, 1953K MFU, 31M MRU, 172K Anon, 592K Header, 42M Other
> > >      3500K Compressed, 29M Uncompressed, 8.61:1 Ratio
> > > Swap: 1024M Total, 1024M Free
> > >=20
> > > The VPS has only 20G of disk space and ZFS compression gives
> > > compressratio 2.22x for ports, 2.51x for src, 2.29x for obj
> > > and 1.95x for installed i386 system plus other software and data.
> >
> > I think we're quite a ways from being ready to axe i386.
> >
> > For VPS applications, we should probably get x32 support in place which
> > should give us the best of both worlds.
> >
> > That said, we either need to rev the i386 ABI to use a 64-bit time_t or
> > kill it in the not to distant future or we risk embedded systems failing
> > in place in 2038.  If we assume a 15 year life for most equipment to
> > fail electrically or mechanically that says FreeBSD 13 shouldn't support
> > the current i386 ABI.
> 
> Rereading this, I'm confused. FreeBSD 13? 2023? Either works for me, 
> though 2023 is more reasonable and gives people more than enough time 
> to migrate.

My guess is that FreeBSD 12 will be supported through 2023, maybe a
little longer.  I'd rather not provide *any* support to the current past
2023 which would imply we shouldn't support it in 13 which will extend
beyond that.  One could come up with a different and also reasonable
timeline and that should probably be a job for core++.  It's worth
noting that we could just decide we're breaking the ABI early in the 13
cycle and not kill i386.

-- Brooks
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