stable vs releng

DTD doug at
Wed Aug 22 20:08:43 UTC 2018

On Wed, 22 Aug 2018, Polytropon wrote:

> On Wed, 22 Aug 2018 13:38:02 -0400 (EDT), doug wrote:
>> On Wed, 22 Aug 2018, Steve O'Hara-Smith wrote:
>>> On Wed, 22 Aug 2018 09:52:36 +0100
>>> Matthew Seaman <matthew at> wrote:
>>>> So no removal of drivers, no
>>>> changes to ABIs, compatibility for 3rd party kernel modules across all
>>>> the kernels in the branch etc.  Some of that I think we're getting
>>>> right, other bits we aren't doing so well with.
>>> <cough>nVidia</cough>
>> I do not understand. If the FreeBSD Desktop support model is a two story
>> outhouse, XORG has always been on the top floor. At least that was my
>> understanding. What am I missing?
> I think the main problem here is the switch from the
> normal text-oriented console subsystem sc to the
> graphics-oriented vt, which of course means more
> demands regarding "addressing the GPU". Additionally,
> X currently requires (!) the use of vt. So while X
> brings its own drivers, the OS now also needs to
> include certain aspects of "programming toward
> hardware".
> According to the vt page, there needs to be support
> for different brands of graphics cards:
> Sure, this is completely out of concern if you just
> want to use the regular text mode - you switch back
> to sc (as vt has become the default), and everything
> works as it did for decades. But you cannot use X in
> that configuration anymore. That's why development
> on vt is ongoing, but not complete yet. But it is
> already more than "good enough" to be included as
> the default console subsystem, as it works in 99 %
> of the typical use cases.
> While you can switch screen sizes in vt (except to
> the one you want), it lacks certain features that
> did exist in sc reliably for many years. But when
> you use X, those are typically not needed, and X
> requires vt, so... those features won't come back.
> "Just use X!" is what solves any problems. ;-)

Indeed, I totally overlooked that. Thanks guys. I have just accepted what the 
console does to me. The servers that really matter I get to via serial console.

Douglas Denault
doug at
Voice: 301-217-9220
   Fax: 301-217-9277

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