Please don't change Beastie to another crap logo such as NetBSD!!!

Ted Mittelstaedt tedm at
Thu Feb 10 21:52:10 PST 2005

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Garance A Drosehn [mailto:gad at]
> Sent: Thursday, February 10, 2005 1:17 PM
> To: Ted Mittelstaedt
> Cc: freebsd-questions at
> Subject: RE: Please don't change Beastie to another crap logo such as
> NetBSD!!!
> At 12:50 AM -0800 2/10/05, Ted Mittelstaedt wrote:
> >
> >>  It is clear from
> >>  reading both lists that much of the anger is based upon false
> >>  assumptions, misinformation and incomplete editing of the leaked
> >>  document.
> >>
> >
> >Sorry, but that is false.
> >
> >Much of the anger is based on Robert Watson (and whatever other
> >core members are arguing with him over this) not IMMEDIATELY
> >becoming completely forthright with the FreeBSD community as
> >soon as the leak occurred.
> Geez.  Get real.
> One committer had *just* put up the site, and then other committers
> were given a chance to look it over and see if it all made sense.
> We wanted to given all committers a chance to cross-check it, and
> make sure we didn't forget to say anything important.

Thank you Garance for being a bit more forthright with the community,
in a grudging sort of way I guess.

> >I am deeply concerned with what I see going on here.  Since when
> >has the FreeBSD Project had "secret" information of a sales and
> >marketing nature?  This is a brand new one to me.
> What a crazy thing to say.  The whole purpose of this web site was
> to announce a PUBLIC CONTEST for ANYONE to submit their ideas for
> a possible new logo.  Once we DID announce it, the public would
> have had 1-3 months to hash out whatever they wanted to hash out.

And of course, the logo selected will not have Beastie in it.  That
does not sound like anyone is free to submit their ideas for a
possible new logo.  That sounds like anyone is free to submit their
ideas that happen to fall into your guy's pre-decided idea of what
the new logo will look like.

> >I can condone secrets in the area of leaglities - such as back in
> >the bad old days when UCB was sued by USL, there were many secrets,
> >a few that I and some others were able to ferret out but still
> >many buried, and still some people under gag orders.
> Man, you must see a lot of black helicopters every day you walk
> to work.
> It is not a "deep dark secret" to proof-read a web site before
> ANNOUNCING TO EVERYONE that they might WIN MONEY(!!) by reading that
> web site.  Geez.  I proof-read this message before I post it, and
> I'm only replying to comments from one moron with black helicopters
> flying out of his ass.

And yet in this posting you have publically stated some things that
were not revealed yesterday in Advocacy or here.  Yet you claim there's
no secrets.  Right.

> How much more time should be spent proof-
> reading a public site which we intend to point everyone at?

Despite all prostations to the contrary this issue has nothing to
do with proofreading.

> >Yes I understand that some commercial consultants and such have had
> >problems due to the logo being a devil image.  But if Robert Watson
> >had wanted to respond to this then he should have brought it up
> >for discussion with the userbase immediately, not sneaked around
> >talking to his cronies at Apple Computer, trying to figure out how
> >to push this off onto the userbase in a way that people wouldn't
> >object to doing so.
> It is apparent that you are not interested in any facts, but Robert
> was not one of the main promoters of this idea.  In fact, I don't
> remember him saying much of anything about it at the time we
> (FreeBSD committers) were debating it.

Then I guess at least Robert had the balls yesterday to get out
and take the heat for something he wasn't promoting - shielding the
rest of you cowards who are promoting it yet are not willing
to admit it on any of the forums that the userbase frequents
and get your shorts flamed off.

> >This logo competition is childish - 99% of the
> >FreeBSD community members are not graphic artists and couldn't draw
> >their way out of a paper bag - such a competition does not have as
> >it's goal that of obtaining an image, it's only goal is assuaging
> >pissed off people by pretending that they have a hand in the decision.
> More black helicopters.  Geez.  I expect all the submissions will
> be public, and then we (the committers) will pick the one we like
> the best.

Exactly.  You committers will pick whatever you want and not what the
userbase wants.  That is why people are spitting mad on this.

> You might remember that the site used to have a very
> nicely drawn cartoon strip.  Extremely well drawn, IMO.  It is a
> pity that you apparently don't get out enough to meet other people,
> but some of us do know people who are very artistic.  Some of them
> even (*gasp*) USE FreeBSD.
> Maybe those users can't write a program, but they might like to
> contribute *THEIR* talents to the project.  What would be wrong
> with that?

And if all they can come up with is more renditions of Beastie, then
you guys are going to be in trouble I guess, since none of you can
draw as you claim.


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