Re: PKGBASE Removes FreeBSD Base System Feature

From: vermaden <vermaden_at_interia.pl>
Date: Wed, 30 Jul 2025 18:30:20 UTC 
Hi.

I have only two proposals that seem sensible.

(1)

Keep pkg(8) for third party packages with /etc/pkg and /usr/local/etc/pkg and /var/db/pkg dirs for configuration.

Use separate pkgbase(8) with /etc/pkgbase and /usr/local/etc/pkgbase and /var/db/pkgbase dirs for managing PKGBASE packages. By pkgbase(8) I have the same pkg(8) project in mind - just renamed as pkgbase(8) and with */pkgbase dirs instead of */pkg.

(2)

My other idea is to 'mark' all FreeBSD Base System packages as 'vital' - so they are never removed automatically - but if someone wants to remove them with additional force option - then I assume he knows what he is doing.

I would prefer (1) over (2) if you ask me.

As for additional groups like base-minimal or base-standard - I do not have anything against such additional features or layers - its not related to the main topic IMHO - that with 'classic' FreeBSD the *pkg delete -af* removes only third party packages and with PKGBASE FreeBSD it removes almost all system rendering it unbootable/unusable.

Hope that helps.

Regards,
vermaden



Temat: Re: PKGBASE Removes FreeBSD Base System Feature
Data: 2025-07-30 4:18
Nadawca: "Shawn Webb" &lt;shawn.webb@hardenedbsd.org>
Adresat: "vermaden" &lt;vermaden@interia.pl>; 
DW: freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org; freebsd-stable@freebsd.org; freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org; freebsd-current@freebsd.org; 

> 
>> On Wed, Jul 30, 2025 at 02:28:35AM +0200, vermaden wrote:
>> Hi,
>> 
>> after short discussion here:
>> - https://github.com/freebsd/pkg/issues/2485
>> 
>> I got REALLY concerned.
>> 
>> One of THE features and selling points of a FreeBSD UNIX system is
the 'untouchable' Base System.
>> 
>> Without PKGBASE all the features are preserved.
>> 
>> But when You convert to PKGBASE its ... GONE!
>> 
>> Consider this command:
>> 
>> # pkg delete -af
>> 
>> What it does?
>> 
>> It removes all third party packages on 'classic' FreeBSD system
without touching the FreeBSD Base System.
>> 
>> What the same "pkg delete -af" command does on a PKGBASE FreeBSD
system?
>> 
>> It kills/destroys almost all of the FreeBSD Base System and leaves
only two PKGBASE packages called:
>> 
>> - FreeBSD-clibs
>> - FreeBSD-runtime
>> 
>> All the rest of Base System is GONE. Destroyed.
> 
> Hey vermaden,
> 
> As mentioned in the GitHub ticket, it appears there might be some room
> for discussion on which base packages ought to be marked vital and if
> the current list (of two) should be expanded.
> 
> I suspect there could also be room for discussion on technical
> measures pkg could adopt to help mitigate issues like this.
> 
> I myself don't have much in the way of suggestions on either topic of
> discussion. I'm simply hoping this email moves the needle forward in a
> positive direction.
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> -- 
> Shawn Webb
> Cofounder / Security Engineer
> HardenedBSD
> 
> Signal Username:  shawn_webb.74
> Tor-ified Signal: +1 303-901-1600 / shawn_webb_opsec.50
>
https://git.hardenedbsd.org/hardenedbsd/pubkeys/-/raw/master/Shawn_Webb/03A4CBEBB82EA5A67D9F3853FF2E67A277F8E1FA.pub.asc
> 
>