From nobody Thu Jan 06 16:41:33 2022 X-Original-To: freebsd-hackers@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8D6D5193E41B for ; Thu, 6 Jan 2022 16:41:51 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wlosh@bsdimp.com) Received: from mail-vk1-xa36.google.com (mail-vk1-xa36.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::a36]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1D4" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4JVBvg3H7sz3qbm for ; Thu, 6 Jan 2022 16:41:51 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wlosh@bsdimp.com) Received: by mail-vk1-xa36.google.com with SMTP id w206so1104795vkd.10 for ; Thu, 06 Jan 2022 08:41:51 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=bsdimp-com.20210112.gappssmtp.com; s=20210112; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=xed6ddoP760+qUtb/hseWE60VTg6BYXft4AaSQnwXwQ=; b=BxtUpwbsKWy86M11mHvc/vqGfCxHojC1nNy8VtVhgGxPa4Tt6F19EnPrfs60i0G3Il SOxzaxZ+LBN8X9cmFVNRVJAnbfAwlzzLZU3faiEolgGRCRrZRrmko5gDYklEktiH4uF1 yu+ZqQHa/cBgAp0glD7Vhy9Mt7K8zBHK7UQGyNn+QazxpUDJ0a0uerd4Fz7mJoi4Xyzz F1mC4Y/aRp8ZEhA6Gm1TtWlwd/vqFVgOZTGjMm2mUU42dn2yJ4j67Vtm8Vj92odiupBe K8kCeNPgwD56s+oXgtbhs9zjj4DDK8V/m0UDrcI2n4sa3I/vuC0R9dFXcpH1NhLegXNW 63tQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=xed6ddoP760+qUtb/hseWE60VTg6BYXft4AaSQnwXwQ=; b=QWscSRXNnhqBkE3mSyvkiju7NPTZwdd2cHLVm8lNBkDgTPZ/vkXTRYtfDDH+ra21dZ l1zDU2P7hlsy6CCEz4jkYxXDy5Q+KwWMfCmVKd+edja6zRmGkBChS5nRW0ovjj+i/eyt uf7la/67mOPmFG8gvDF0+4Ofb7hMY0GLTc2ieyZ5impZpsek6lsIhn/mYXXsU6+vcxwu tYeSYY4K7+HLIRahwp62Hu2GI7ssDCSKytxp64Sro5RzILQOTdUupZiwTlzG28HwGWW4 tu1FBwFx6r68/2Gz3JmEERTGicbYNaxatO1aQHUEcTT8WTc5tqLQ4JlJ1HokhgwxqG1V u6YA== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM5330mL/OT7pA+pJ6o0+r7inbwL5toy+ieuteu9I6QAwyRyuWnZnZ 95BKpiht4k9C72E8vo4CLcugybwanAGRsNY2bT4obJETEjc= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJzMqKWLK1cNx9Z+sR5f9DXs1NM5ZUTgPfOv+GrBvFcqs4cy9C/hKUvCsdT6xqwvElejsBYietiZ2W4+Fhy/0Qg= X-Received: by 2002:a1f:1688:: with SMTP id 130mr21130633vkw.27.1641487304662; Thu, 06 Jan 2022 08:41:44 -0800 (PST) List-Id: Technical discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-hackers List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <864k6qj6x6.fsf@phe.ftfl.ca> <86zgoihs64.fsf@phe.ftfl.ca> In-Reply-To: From: Warner Losh Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2022 09:41:33 -0700 Message-ID: Subject: Re: 5.9 points Re: 7.0 points 5.1 points Re: Call for Foundation-supported Project Ideas To: Stefan Blachmann Cc: FreeBSD Hackers Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000b2cf8705d4ec8ba6" X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4JVBvg3H7sz3qbm X-Spamd-Bar: ---- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; none X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; REPLY(-4.00)[] X-ThisMailContainsUnwantedMimeParts: N --000000000000b2cf8705d4ec8ba6 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" On Thu, Jan 6, 2022, 9:35 AM Stefan Blachmann wrote: > Correct. > Only late in the discussion Warner mentioned that the kms drm drivers > need to be loaded. > So my request has became moot. > > The drm kmod drivers usually are being associated as graphics drivers for > xorg. > Thus it is not at all intuitive/obvious that these are also required > on console-only computers to make resuming succeed. > > Given this, it is rather a *documentation* *issue*, as the necessity > to install/load the drm kmod drivers is *not* mentioned anywhere in > the documentation regarding suspend/resume, making users wonder why > resuming fails. > Absolutely agreed on need more docs and an update pass. I raised it as part of this year's core team meeting with the foundation. Though this one issue likely can be handled by a simple document PR. Warner > On 1/6/22, Joerg Sonnenberger wrote: > > On Wed, Jan 05, 2022 at 11:22:39AM -0700, Warner Losh wrote: > >> Why bother. Load the kms drm drivers. The suspend/resume code is in > those > >> drivers. They work console, X11 and wayland, more or less. It's an > >> absolutely > >> insane idea to spend limited funds on the crazy ideas presented in this > >> thread. > >> They are known to be flakey, unreliable or technically just not > possible. > > > > The main problem is that modern VGA devices often only have just enough > > VESA BIOS support to give Windows a generic framebuffer as fallback. > > Otherwise, I don't think it is as flakey. All that said, spending funds > > on it would certainly be misdirected. > > > > Joerg > > > > > > --000000000000b2cf8705d4ec8ba6 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


On Thu, Jan 6, 2022, 9:35 AM Stefan Blachmann <sblachmann@gmail.com> wrote:
=
Correct.
Only late in the discussion Warner mentioned that the kms drm drivers
need to be loaded.
So my request has became moot.

The drm kmod drivers usually are being associated as graphics drivers for x= org.
Thus it is not at all intuitive/obvious that these are also required
on console-only computers to make resuming succeed.

Given this, it is rather a *documentation* *issue*, as the necessity
to install/load the drm kmod drivers is *not* mentioned anywhere in
the documentation regarding suspend/resume, making users wonder why
resuming fails.

Absolutely agreed on need more docs and an update pass. I ra= ised it as part of this year's core team meeting with the foundation. T= hough this one issue likely can be handled by a simple document PR.

Warner
<= br>

On 1/6/22, Joerg Sonnenberger <joerg@bec.de> wrote:
> On Wed, Jan 05, 2022 at 11:22:39AM -0700, Warner Losh wrote:
>> Why bother. Load the kms drm drivers. The suspend/resume code is i= n those
>> drivers. They work console, X11 and wayland, more or less.=C2=A0 I= t's an
>> absolutely
>> insane idea to spend limited funds on the crazy ideas presented in= this
>> thread.
>> They are known to be flakey, unreliable or technically just not po= ssible.
>
> The main problem is that modern VGA devices often only have just enoug= h
> VESA BIOS support to give Windows a generic framebuffer as fallback. > Otherwise, I don't think it is as flakey. All that said, spending = funds
> on it would certainly be misdirected.
>
> Joerg
>
>

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