From nobody Wed Nov 24 10:05:59 2021 X-Original-To: freebsd-hackers@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CAE6218AC72E for ; Wed, 24 Nov 2021 10:06:02 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from sblachmann@gmail.com) Received: from mail-lf1-x134.google.com (mail-lf1-x134.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::134]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1D4" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4Hzc8n47Trz3HZy for ; Wed, 24 Nov 2021 10:06:01 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from sblachmann@gmail.com) Received: by mail-lf1-x134.google.com with SMTP id u3so5816553lfl.2 for ; Wed, 24 Nov 2021 02:06:01 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=R3YnfgG4GZ6ilEW2KxH21T1jo7FGd/xLhh5MhZgj8Ls=; b=grtuacTzdyfdg4B2YXfgUa6FLAsAoC0T2Xn+IaDCLNpZ8umQZlkv/KcY4bKaXbZ1UI U1nuibrMMD6Xw4F5XdwHHQU5TsXa+JQroR8Px+er0wHz4putuaPU2s1Qjv7UCwBS+vDV jQxHbgNSnH4mvSV+Bx76LIAucw8uI7bLtWNFLqnN21+mmd03SRk4hf9qARyYOUGU6t9e MF0oGFm2l6vpHFYo1w3gwjgs6pHfZlQabQJuZffmKo5/0bKRvXRnYmE2xOldPMP919CI D4c3wCMl0JRM8OJxsDo+6CN84ugvITdpGMb1xUjiEyUHaquG5NODN0R4xsVqgRWPUPzW EVCw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=R3YnfgG4GZ6ilEW2KxH21T1jo7FGd/xLhh5MhZgj8Ls=; b=kL4ZeLSgVjRYNikhULS028jlxrzclAxyIf3ToHZvLGSvtnmVlqYw35ncbJxG2PPAMO 70KuU0b+jQD3ZbUdQIzslxCxTCuVfTx17XtdVCXcQ16DK/jLDAtfYc0rmvpgLsY5BP4C puJE/71EkOqXnqnp/MeXWzb3Hs3x/eiXPmAmnInWpoMo6wPiFfJzsQ2qv/L/7XR1YBoO RzurMbdb67kO2te23JVZiOsG+4kFsaNDiXcCZWD9iA/vxOw6VMjQa2q0YCvMgvv8aAez Ol8R/1WWlklk7USMs2sppFu9UEQnQBoa1NEQKMgNB9bto6+lrs/mu5xCS1Jv7fIDxtDW kMxA== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM530bjsdZbZQMYRM5D7yBhEtSUML9TeSgZnaM0TJlOiJL2D83iFTY UZE9kZg8T59FG+kUwr1+nR4skYs/OvGfJjBMfeM7nMcw X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJz1QOMmvX6OAzdWkyJRAJ11m0SxeZ5yaWWyPp3bwYN+2kP26zFbmh+l8faUUc7yapVjgDRnvwOwrlKRL3cxC78= X-Received: by 2002:a19:6717:: with SMTP id b23mr12874056lfc.659.1637748359893; Wed, 24 Nov 2021 02:05:59 -0800 (PST) List-Id: Technical discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-hackers List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 2002:a05:651c:1242:0:0:0:0 with HTTP; Wed, 24 Nov 2021 02:05:59 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: <861r36xzpe.fsf@phe.ftfl.ca> From: Stefan Blachmann Date: Wed, 24 Nov 2021 11:05:59 +0100 Message-ID: Subject: Re: Call for Foundation-supported Project Ideas To: Jason Bacon Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4Hzc8n47Trz3HZy X-Spamd-Bar: -- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20210112 header.b=grtuacTz; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of sblachmann@gmail.com designates 2a00:1450:4864:20::134 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=sblachmann@gmail.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-2.00 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20210112]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2a00:1450:4000::/36:c]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(1.00)[1.000]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROMTLD(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[gmail.com:+]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[2a00:1450:4864:20::134:from]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[gmail.com,none]; FREEMAIL_TO(0.00)[gmail.com]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2a00:1450::/32, country:US]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com:dkim] X-ThisMailContainsUnwantedMimeParts: N Port nouveau to FreeBSD. Reason: There are ongoing changes in the xorg API which break older proprietary Nvidia cards' legacy drivers. In addition, Nvidia plans to drop/discontinue support for their 390 driver in 2022. Nvidia already stopped support releases for their 340 and older drivers so that a lot of Nvidia graphics cards can no longer be used on FreeBSD already or will be unusable very soon. https://nvidia.custhelp.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/3142/~/support-timeframes-for-unix-legacy-gpu-releases On 11/24/21, Stefan Blachmann wrote: > Proposal: > Clean up the xorg graphics card/driver list and remove these ones that > do no longer work. > > Explanation: > > On 11/24/21, Jason Bacon wrote: >> One hurdle I've not yet been able to conquer is automatic GPU >> configuration. The best I've been able to do so far is an interactive >> script that requires some rather technical decisions from the users: >> >> It would be really nice is we could replace this with a simple, maybe >> even automated tool to configure a working Xorg setup on most common >> hardware. Wouldn't matter to me if it falls back on scfb or vesa in >> many cases, as long as it's easy to use and produces a working desktop. >> >> Bonus points for not requiring a reboot to properly activate the DRM >> module. >> >> I wouldn't obsess about making it work on *all* hardware off-the-bat. I >> think it would be more fruitful to first develop a system that works >> *really* well on the most common hardware. Then we have a product that >> people will want, which will help recruit the people we'll need to work >> on expanding hardware support. > > I have done this already. > My script does autodetect and autoconfigure *all* graphics cards/chips > for which are drivers available in FreeBSD. > It also works with multiple graphics cards, autodetecting whether they > can work together or not (when drivers cannot coexist). > The script is not yet ready for release, as autoconfiguring multi-head > configurations (eg multi-monitor configurations either with multiple > GPU outputs and/or multiple graphics cards) is still WIP. > (If you are interested in this topic anyway, please either mail me > directly or open a separate discussion thread.) > > However, the problem is that some drivers can no longer work because > libxaa.so (and maybe other xorg libs, too) has been removed upstream > 10 years ago already. > See this for more info: > https://bugs.freebsd.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=257417 > > This is the background of my proposal: > - Test all graphics drivers on real hardware whether they are still > functional in currently-supported FreeBSD releases > - Remove all those drivers that can no longer work because xorg > upstream dropped support. > - Feed back to xorg upstrean so they can obsolete/remove these now > useless drivers. > > I'd certainly be more motivated to do this if it is being sponsored, > as I have already collected most (except for a few very rare and > expensive AGP graphics cards) of the hardware in question. > Because, 1. it needs some money to obtain these lacking (past > high-end, mainly workstation usage) cards, and 2. it takes some time > to walk through them and test every and each of these. >