From nobody Fri Nov 11 20:51:34 2022 X-Original-To: freebsd-fs@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4N89qx6st3z4g1wm for ; Fri, 11 Nov 2022 20:52:13 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from karl@denninger.net) Received: from colo1.denninger.net (colo1.denninger.net [104.236.120.189]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4N89qx1dkGz4VLx for ; Fri, 11 Nov 2022 20:52:13 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from karl@denninger.net) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of karl@denninger.net designates 104.236.120.189 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=karl@denninger.net; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=denninger.net Received: from denninger.net (097-081-026-048.res.spectrum.com [97.81.26.48]) by colo1.denninger.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 803A62110B3 for ; Fri, 11 Nov 2022 15:51:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from [192.168.10.25] (D15.Denninger.Net [192.168.10.25]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) by denninger.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 3AB702401DC for ; Fri, 11 Nov 2022 15:51:37 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Fri, 11 Nov 2022 15:51:34 -0500 List-Id: Filesystems List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-fs List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-fs@freebsd.org MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64; rv:102.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/102.4.2 Subject: Re: Odd behaviour of two identical ZFS servers mirroring via rsync Content-Language: en-US To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org References: From: Karl Denninger In-Reply-To: Content-Type: multipart/signed; protocol="application/pkcs7-signature"; micalg=sha-512; boundary="------------ms090109010601050609040103" X-Spamd-Bar: ----- X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-5.90 / 15.00]; SIGNED_SMIME(-2.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-0.999]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-0.996]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[denninger.net,none]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+mx]; MIME_GOOD(-0.20)[multipart/signed,multipart/alternative,text/plain]; MLMMJ_DEST(0.00)[freebsd-fs@freebsd.org]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:14061, ipnet:104.236.64.0/18, country:US]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+,2:+,3:~,4:~]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; FREEFALL_USER(0.00)[karl]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; HAS_ATTACHMENT(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-fs@freebsd.org]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4N89qx1dkGz4VLx X-ThisMailContainsUnwantedMimeParts: N This is a cryptographically signed message in MIME format. --------------ms090109010601050609040103 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------z7dqCKJCEbxiqibeBbpS56ey" --------------z7dqCKJCEbxiqibeBbpS56ey Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Are you sure there are no snapshots that are holding blocks?  If so those become copy-on write and will not be released even if the alleged file is deleted, as the snapshot copy is still there and valid. On 11/11/2022 15:20, andy thomas wrote: > Yes, I can confirm the rsync --delete option is being used and in > fact, 'du' reports some of the mirrored folders as having identical > sizes on both servers, mainly those containing only small amounts of > data. > > It seems almost as if ZFS is not freeing up blocks when rsync has > deleted or shrank files, leaving unwanted blocks lurking around in the > folder that 'du' then discovers and adds to its tally when it works > out the space usage of that folder! > > I suppose I could always destroy the zfs dataset on the mirror server > & resync the whole thing but will take days to complete even over a 10 > Gbit/s network link (the servers ought to be upgraded to FBSD 13.1 as > well). > > Andy > > On Fri, 11 Nov 2022, Mehmet Erol Sanliturk wrote: > >> >> , Nov 11, 2022 at 8:42 PM andy thomas wrote: >>       I have two identical servers, called clustor2 and >>       clustor-backup, each >>       with a ZFS RAIDZ-1 pool containing 9 SAS hard disks plus one >>       spare and two >>       SSDs for the ZIL and ARC functions. clustor2 stores user data >>       from a >>       HPC while clustor2-backup uses rsync to mirrors all the data >>       from clustor2 >>       every 24 hours. >> >>       However, the disk usage on the mirror server is considerably >>       more than on >>       the other server - attached is a screenshot showing the two >>       servers side >>       by side, with the mirror server on the right, and displaying the >>       contents >>       of the same subdirectory choen at random (named 'ratio_10.0' in >>       this >>       instance); as you can see, the sizes of the files within each of >>       the >>       folders are identical but 'du' reports very different >>       space usages for each folder and 'zpool list' also reports a >>       significant >>       difference in ZFS pool size. >> >>       I'm not sure if this is relevant but both servers have ZFS pools >>       with no >>       compression although lz4 compression is enabled on the ZFS >>       filesystems & >>       both run FreeBSD 11.3 with ZFS version 5. >> >>       Perhaps using zfs send/receive instead of rsync for mirroring >>       might solve >>       this disparity? >> >>       Thanks in advance for any suggestions, >> >>       Andy >> >> >> >> >> Your question I am understanding the following points . >> >> >> >> I am using  rsync  in Fedora Linux . >> >> There are  parameters of  rsync  such as >> >>  --delete >> >> to delete files from the destination drive when they do not exist in the >> source drive . >> >> >> Please carefully scan  rsync  parameters and use suitable ones for your >> application . >> >> >> If  a parameter like  --delete  is not used , rsync  copies new files >> from >> the source drive and >> it does not delete any files from the destination drive . >> >> >> With my best wishes for all . >> >> >> Mehmet Erol Sanliturk >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > ---------------------------- > Andy Thomas, > Time Domain Systems > > Tel: +44 (0)7866 556626 > http://www.time-domain.co.uk -- Karl Denninger karl@denninger.net /The Market Ticker/ /[S/MIME encrypted email preferred]/ --------------z7dqCKJCEbxiqibeBbpS56ey Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Are you sure there are no snapshots that are holding blocks?  If so those become copy-on write and will not be released even if the alleged file is deleted, as the snapshot copy is still there and valid.

On 11/11/2022 15:20, andy thomas wrote:
Yes, I can confirm the rsync --delete option is being used and in fact, 'du' reports some of the mirrored folders as having identical sizes on both servers, mainly those containing only small amounts of data.

It seems almost as if ZFS is not freeing up blocks when rsync has deleted or shrank files, leaving unwanted blocks lurking around in the folder that 'du' then discovers and adds to its tally when it works out the space usage of that folder!

I suppose I could always destroy the zfs dataset on the mirror server & resync the whole thing but will take days to complete even over a 10 Gbit/s network link (the servers ought to be upgraded to FBSD 13.1 as well).

Andy

On Fri, 11 Nov 2022, Mehmet Erol Sanliturk wrote:


, Nov 11, 2022 at 8:42 PM andy thomas <andy@time-domain.co.uk> wrote:
      I have two identical servers, called clustor2 and
      clustor-backup, each
      with a ZFS RAIDZ-1 pool containing 9 SAS hard disks plus one
      spare and two
      SSDs for the ZIL and ARC functions. clustor2 stores user data
      from a
      HPC while clustor2-backup uses rsync to mirrors all the data
      from clustor2
      every 24 hours.

      However, the disk usage on the mirror server is considerably
      more than on
      the other server - attached is a screenshot showing the two
      servers side
      by side, with the mirror server on the right, and displaying the
      contents
      of the same subdirectory choen at random (named 'ratio_10.0' in
      this
      instance); as you can see, the sizes of the files within each of
      the
      folders are identical but 'du' reports very different
      space usages for each folder and 'zpool list' also reports a
      significant
      difference in ZFS pool size.

      I'm not sure if this is relevant but both servers have ZFS pools
      with no
      compression although lz4 compression is enabled on the ZFS
      filesystems &
      both run FreeBSD 11.3 with ZFS version 5.

      Perhaps using zfs send/receive instead of rsync for mirroring
      might solve
      this disparity?

      Thanks in advance for any suggestions,

      Andy




Your question I am understanding the following points .



I am using  rsync  in Fedora Linux .

There are  parameters of  rsync  such as

 --delete

to delete files from the destination drive when they do not exist in the
source drive .


Please carefully scan  rsync  parameters and use suitable ones for your
application .


If  a parameter like  --delete  is not used , rsync  copies new files from
the source drive and
it does not delete any files from the destination drive .


With my best wishes for all .


Mehmet Erol Sanliturk






 




----------------------------
Andy Thomas,
Time Domain Systems

Tel: +44 (0)7866 556626
http://www.time-domain.co.uk
--
Karl Denninger
karl@denninger.net
The Market Ticker
[S/MIME encrypted email preferred]
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