From nobody Sun Aug 10 09:33:05 2025 X-Original-To: freebsd-current@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4c0CHk3xHVz64HBG for ; Sun, 10 Aug 2025 09:33:22 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from theraven@FreeBSD.org) Received: from smtp.freebsd.org (smtp.freebsd.org [96.47.72.83]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.freebsd.org", Issuer "R11" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4c0CHk21xSz40Zj; Sun, 10 Aug 2025 09:33:22 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from theraven@FreeBSD.org) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=freebsd.org; s=dkim; t=1754818402; h=from:from:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date:message-id:message-id: to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version:content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references; bh=F/G+sZGcZSq+mNxKWal14RT5pn5h4wESr2gej5+nUm4=; b=TzhS70+5h4gvTdgba4EB5Utdv5yVpWKYXQxvgn5S9tH+MHD/XJE11t0+hNsMiqoiHR0y5U M3A31a/pOFhdu6U53qsGeLKBfr0H1k0qSqcH0rXKna/22NqkiDTax5Au3pzAvU083fTjH2 pM14vUYvXEYI0N7JzSuSYcOcZOwP0xkLzlztMi/wqQo11gYIpkXRM/oOd0qPlDfBLcUTVa jGlQOPSs6u2BohyoFiAiolFmbWTBBEjlp3lSZMqu1spUUCEHommt8WIVlVPhBhMEoyeIRI L8sGd/kwJ/wlp4rkPe48EcsUJyHHF8GNBz3gnNmgBTNPdBkh1NQyzn1wwA8aoQ== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=freebsd.org; s=dkim; t=1754818402; h=from:from:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date:message-id:message-id: to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version:content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references; bh=F/G+sZGcZSq+mNxKWal14RT5pn5h4wESr2gej5+nUm4=; b=aNrkVJxcAiYstmHbLZGq+HG+GU6Yf7mIPkMB7aqu4ijc70MXtOcqJYZXRTKhvWlRarqvbe i5HPxnUL8R1NyNPyUqlMmpM6szr+UJEVzImZvCqr1MHTmeKyzkcmp2jXZ7cxWtYec17XLY EM+nHYUunqv4g6vREaAf42fzokpawT2SMI2MJs1RSOF2XsFYh3XffVWjk2yFsSrDb/HxYu WYXcArVHA59QJFKHkDfhh1MqprhU9yVOKyqJiusOZx402RoZQos/GSdYjW6KhwTncPPU2s 2PkM5n4gMRg+9U3J8rIwQp8AeJ2ieCnejYtwfSlYkRDV1VtqonMqCnJI/BSFpg== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; mx1.freebsd.org; none ARC-Seal: i=1; s=dkim; d=freebsd.org; t=1754818402; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=wmXoFn5ZnoFoJKUj1xShr6DbuR7znDPiBrZfwV8sfHXakm7FfUZfdRWq0HtSo1pDO2uSvQ uORmYfoYqDBlpcq+j+kPNlXUhn3zwcgoplkZfsSeSuqsf1VXwtoIZNjMbjGLh0R4xljPt3 txT03tfRLNxdJuT+mAFXaIUAIcdb+rx8RxTjQAqMcGBFk1E3XPP6iRYr9qLDy9HkJ67GpO F10EBHJPqvwkvXvqSJDSVqY+Ho+4ZNfuwoUTqhlqa/SSOs6VzXGIYPLTzWrNHdNQcxthel F85Nb7ECXZs05DhD1r0hA/uK/vYVXXy25ph/KLBB8X9aZi5KKu2CBL2wj+Yhog== Received: from smtp.theravensnest.org (smtp.theravensnest.org [45.77.103.195]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256) (Client did not present a certificate) (Authenticated sender: theraven) by smtp.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4c0CHk1bFhzHXp; Sun, 10 Aug 2025 09:33:22 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from theraven@FreeBSD.org) Received: from smtpclient.apple (host86-143-41-189.range86-143.btcentralplus.com [86.143.41.189]) by smtp.theravensnest.org (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 647A0BE4; Sun, 10 Aug 2025 10:33:21 +0100 (BST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-current List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.org Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 16.0 \(3776.700.51.11.1\)) Subject: Re: PKGBASE Removes FreeBSD Base System Feature From: David Chisnall In-Reply-To: <20250809224836.f7207c3be3fbc8e0fd97f856@dec.sakura.ne.jp> Date: Sun, 10 Aug 2025 10:33:05 +0100 Cc: David G Lawrence , Warner Losh , Michal Meloun , FreeBSD Current Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <558632AE-5331-4339-A979-BA6F9B9C0840@FreeBSD.org> References: <20250809062925.GN26557@mailx.dglawrence.com> <929543B2-633E-44B5-B6F6-F292CCEADAB3@freebsd.org> <20250809065247.GO26557@mailx.dglawrence.com> <96820ff6-bdb0-4d25-ad78-502e30b7e479@FreeBSD.org> <20250809185418.7d272536dd5862d0bdfd39c2@dec.sakura.ne.jp> <20250809101145.GS26557@mailx.dglawrence.com> <20250809114244.GU26557@mailx.dglawrence.com> <20250809224836.f7207c3be3fbc8e0fd97f856@dec.sakura.ne.jp> To: Tomoaki AOKI X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3776.700.51.11.1) On 9 Aug 2025, at 14:48, Tomoaki AOKI wrote: >=20 > As Vermaden replied to different thread of this topic, his issue > seems to be "in jail". IIUC, he attempted to deinstall everything > installed PkgPkg (in contrast with PkgBase) keeping PkgBase world > in the jail intact, but result was everything including PkgBase > in the jail was deinstalled and made the jail unkillable. > And stating there should be kinda "safety net" for such a case. It=E2=80=99s worth noting that this is precisely the kind of thing that = the OCI model avoids entirely. You don=E2=80=99t *upgrade* a container, = you create container images from a description, you create container = instances from images. The issue of uninstalling things in a container = never arises, because you simply destroy the container and create a new = one and import persistent data as volumes. dch@, dfr@, and others have done phenomenal work to enable jails as the = isolation mechanism for OCI containers and pkgbase is a key part of = making this useful. David