Re: PKGBASE Removes FreeBSD Base System Feature

> > > > kmod in the ports is a different problem ??? it shows the inability of
> > > > FBSD developers to implement these things on their own,  so this
> > > > solution  has some problems.  And don't kill me, I fully understand
> > that
> > > > it's not possible , but that doesn't change the previous fact.
> > > >
> > > > Michal
> > >
> > > Sometimes yes, but sometimes no.
> > >
> > > On early but widely testable developement phase for drivers, especially
> > > SD card drivers, network (including but not limited with WiFi) drivers
> > > and disk controllers, base is not a good place even for FreeBSD-native
> > > drivers.
> > >
> > > This is because turnaround time for implememt (fix) / test / commit
> > > on base is usually take much longer days (or even months!) than in
> > > ports. So recently, AFAIK, some drivers are first developed as
> > > kmod ports, and once stabilized, merged into main branch of src.
> > >
> > > What comes in my mind is rtsx driver for Realtek SD card reader driver.
> >
> > Tomoaki,
> >
> >    I see what you're saying and I agree completely. But, I think this is
> > pointing squarely at problem in the development paradigm for src
> > committers.
> > It should not take weeks or months to fix/test/commit/repeat in src. It
> > didn't used to be that way, so if it is now, then something has broken
> > in the paradigm, and _that_ needs to be fixed.
> >
> 
> Fun fact: bectl would completely fix the pkg delete issue. But I digress:
> rm -rf In the wrong spot also will kill base. It's a strange hill to die
> on. It also ignores common use cases, like wifibox, that make a system
> critically dependent on ports that in simplwr times didn't happen...
> 
> But some perspective on rtsx.  the rtsx driver is an obscure edge case 1000
> times less popular than the sdhci driver. And even that is 1000x less
> popular than nvme. Given limited time and lack of ability to buy the rtsx
> hardware easily, it's hard to justify using my time for that driver when
> testing patches for other drivers is easier and benefits more people.
> That's why I passed over some of the changes there, especially since there
> were big issues with that driver initially that would have taken a lot of
> time to articulate. That is how I have prioritized my time on the thousands
> of fixes i have done for people, many the same day. Using it as a
> posterchild for src being slow overstates the problems typical patches have
> gwtting in.
> 
> I have been trying to solve the actual, underlying problems behind it:
> getting the pipeline flowing better through reduced friction for
> submissions (some good, but many lousy and it takes time to sort and you
> never know if a lot of feedback will produce a better outcome for any given
> problematic patch). Getting a deeper bench onboard and growing aspects of
> our culture are also key areas needing help. I've had a hard time getting
> others to help, assume ownership, follow through on promises, etc. If you
> want to help fix things, it's helping me fix this problem. Fixing that
> increases the scarse developer resources and helps make it easier to fix
> more issues. But 4 years in, it is a problem resistant to easy solutions.
> 
> Warner

   ...and for the record, I didn't have any idea about where the problem
is/was, but now I see it clearly, and I did not intend to critizise anyone.
I, as well as anyone I think, understand that FreeBSD is a volunteer
project and any time that a developer puts into it is a _gift_, and we
must never lose sight of that.
   But now I'm going to say something controversial: I was disappointed
by the reaction about AI, and how it could help the project, in the
developers list. While I fully appreciate the concerns about "stealing"
other people's work (indirectly through the training of the vast corpus of
the Internet) - i.e., the potential to violate copyright, what was said in
that thread - to dismiss what AI could do for the project, for the
development cycle - was exceptionally, tragically, myopic. Most people in
the world (and here I mean 5 Sigma +) have no idea what's about to hit
them. I've been deep in AI research recently and I can tell you, first
hand, well...we're in for interesting times ahead. We can either embrace
it or be tossed into the scrap heap of history.

-DG

 *  Dr. David G. Lawrence
* * DG Labs
    Pave the road of life with opportunities.