From nobody Tue Aug 05 03:31:59 2025 X-Original-To: freebsd-current@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4bwzWX6T4Gz63v30 for ; Tue, 05 Aug 2025 03:32:24 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd-current-freebsd-org111@ketas.si.pri.ee) Received: from mail.ketas.si.pri.ee (d004-fea2-0bff-021e-13e8-8437-07d0-2001.dyn.estpak.ee [IPv6:2001:7d0:8437:13e8:21e:bff:fea2:d004]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4bwzWW4b8tz3y6G for ; Tue, 05 Aug 2025 03:32:23 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd-current-freebsd-org111@ketas.si.pri.ee) Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=ketas.si.pri.ee header.s=ketas-si-pri-ee-20240416002854-4096 header.b=HkWAWKuy; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of freebsd-current-freebsd-org111@ketas.si.pri.ee designates 2001:7d0:8437:13e8:21e:bff:fea2:d004 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=freebsd-current-freebsd-org111@ketas.si.pri.ee; dmarc=pass (policy=reject) header.from=ketas.si.pri.ee X-Original-To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=ketas.si.pri.ee; s=ketas-si-pri-ee-20240416002854-4096; t=1754364722; bh=xFlwTiOkL0F4rsC5siIFo7v/8pgnPBd/0bzTwgRMuLs=; h=Date:From:To:Subject:In-Reply-To:References; b=HkWAWKuyz/IwNvdZnwNiNowa5Ayawwebu0U4RzLUz4ewECP4FlUryLBiyhUOENVN4 o18dpLKuxSonSiHYbJANhKMzMGUSb3/ysr0JhvI5ZP9Jk92SxScrmZuuHFbjIP/68O Y1wxIm568BeE/uOudSoRE0GLFcS1VUeONUzOTUqGI4DWfBRddoLI4ejJbVweQSTwAF 6x9jUep/m39kVBT6lWTkJ1ljs3/y1Zkd5n5pIXpyasYffD9cnGuuVDHTfBbgy9sbqB jY10P5UsZ4Lh5nK21aY8AM4n5CqxpbqrOhckO7bffqeNd5BiWn9b/KUnLu2h5GK2h1 fJRr7NIeDE6/KVJLpP2Vpv6D2EzQBMIW4qOrZOEkvyCHPZ3IZdBCY2vFZXKXht0j2i GLjfMEMDpEFXYjyiiyXtcz9WCkpMRteLLNZDA+RUpUQHML76pda2mVihcjoOnsAbDG LlqRanBwfYh9rmsaQnuJYYzaPVNRgmuX9DffPOAo9lJv3tftQj1D661qB8lhS3FwV7 qxLvgWfzKhUmW2kEWHqdMqtV7w/uSzY1bgRIfXbYkxLG75HAHb9l3WB24+JD4CS4aD C7t6fZXqdPoTsEJWwtREmZwwONNrp2QlU8IIuiLTBIPfFpme4HBmGx7pF4VipRQhfW NLO8WYqHoGm3h21UFjDH/h10= Received: from [IPv6:::1] (0115-0000-0000-0000-13c8-8437-07d0-2001.dyn.estpak.ee [IPv6:2001:7d0:8437:13c8::115]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) by mail.ketas.si.pri.ee (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 96FF75A7D20 for ; Tue, 05 Aug 2025 06:32:01 +0300 (EEST) Date: Tue, 05 Aug 2025 06:31:59 +0300 From: Sulev-Madis Silber To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: PKGBASE Removes FreeBSD Base System Feature User-Agent: K-9 Mail for Android In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <967353A4-1A54-46D6-9BB9-5E1A741DB789@ketas.si.pri.ee> List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-current List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-0.79 / 15.00]; HFILTER_HOSTNAME_5(3.00)[d004-fea2-0bff-021e-13e8-8437-07d0-2001.dyn.estpak.ee]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.99)[-0.993]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[ketas.si.pri.ee,reject]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[ketas.si.pri.ee:s=ketas-si-pri-ee-20240416002854-4096]; ONCE_RECEIVED(0.20)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2001:7d0:8437:1300::/56]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; ASN(0.00)[asn:3249, ipnet:2001:7d0::/32, country:EE]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; RCVD_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; MLMMJ_DEST(0.00)[freebsd-current@freebsd.org]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-current@freebsd.org]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[ketas.si.pri.ee:+] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4bwzWW4b8tz3y6G X-Spamd-Bar: / someone had creative idea to replace csh with sh without porting "useless" = features over=2E partial history search is one example=2E thankfully csh is= still there=2E i get that some people use bash everywhere as interactive s= hell which i don't=2E funnily i can't even find way to configure it in bash= ? i've always used that feature since 4=2E6 and i would be surprised if ans= wer is nobody needs that=2E it was added and enabled for a reason=2E how co= me now we say it's not needed? sh got several interactive use help features= but who decided and what? i expect many fbsd users and dev have used it wa= y before 4=2E6=2E was it like bash all the way or=2E=2E=2E? noone even used= csh? the default? if so, why was the shell csh until now? why was it even = changed? and why was it changed to sh? granted, no other shells but=2E mayb= e we could upgrade sh so you can also interactively actually use it=2E but = for now i just need to change it back p=2Es=2E: i also never got and never get why there's tendency to bully use= rs off of using some software=2E csh is one of them On August 1, 2025 5:22:18 PM GMT+03:00, David Chisnall wrote: =2E=2E=2E >[1] I=E2=80=99ve noticed on fresh installs, the default shell no longer h= as working persistent history, which is a *big* POLA violation, if people w= ant to complain about something=2E