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Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID 073a0908a56912cc29dd80f1880fef0b; Fri, 31 Mar 2023 14:51:48 +0000 (UTC) From: Mark Millard Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-current List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 16.0 \(3731.400.51.1.1\)) Subject: Re: NanoBSD: CURRENT unable to compile 13-STABLE : ld: error: args.o: Opaque pointers are only supported in -opaque-pointers mode (Producer: 'LLVM15.0.7' Reader: 'LLVM 14.0.5') Message-Id: Date: Fri, 31 Mar 2023 07:51:36 -0700 To: void , Current FreeBSD , FreeBSD Toolchain X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3731.400.51.1.1) References: X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-3.50 / 15.00]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-1.00)[-1.000]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[yahoo.com,reject]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[yahoo.com:s=s2048]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ptr:yahoo.com]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[yahoo.com:dkim]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:36647, ipnet:98.137.64.0/20, country:US]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[98.137.65.82:from]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[yahoo.com]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[yahoo.com:+]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; FREEMAIL_TO(0.00)[f-m.fm,freebsd.org]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[yahoo.com]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; MLMMJ_DEST(0.00)[freebsd-current@freebsd.org] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4Pp3CX4SY2z47wk X-Spamd-Bar: --- X-ThisMailContainsUnwantedMimeParts: N void wrote on Date: Fri, 31 Mar 2023 13:18:34 UTC : > On Thu, Mar 30, 2023 at 07:30:15PM -0700, Mark Millard wrote: > >Warner Losh wrote on > >Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2023 22:15:38 UTC : > > > >> On Thu, Mar 30, 2023, 3:45 PM void wrote: > >> > >> > On Thu, Mar 30, 2023 at 12:56:53PM -0700, Mark Millard wrote: > >> > > >> > >To my knowledge, FreeBSD has not actively supported newer > >> > >FreeBSD building older FreeBSD across versions. > >> > > >> > Are you sure? I routinely build & run 12.4 and 12-stable bhyve and > >> > poudriere jail instances on -current. > >> > > > >Do you use main's toolchain to do your builds of releng/12.4 > >and stable/12 ? The first time? Their updating builds? As far > >as I can see use of main's toolchain means not using an older > >user space (via/in-a chroot, jail, etc.) to do the builds. > > I don't know in detail about the toolchain. When 12.4 builds on > -current, the screen shows it bootstrapping, and I guess this is for > 12.4. > > The reason I commented on what you wrote was because your assertion > appeared to me[1] to be incorrect, in that logically following on from that > assertion would mean 'don't expect it to work because it's 'not > actively supported' meaning that it's 'unsupported'. > > But I can't contextualise 'actively supported' into 'should work' or > 'expected to work' given Warren's comment about 'best effort basis'. > > I build poudriere jails for 12.4 on -current like so: > > 1. git -C /usr/src checkout releng/12.4 > 2. poudriere jail -c -j 124Ramd64 -J12 -m src=/usr/src -b -v releng/12.4 > > To update: > > 3. git -C /usr/src checkout releng/12.4 > 4. git -C /usr/src pull --ff-only > 5. then I have to delete and build the jail as in [2] otherwise it'll > complain about wrong objectprefix > > is this workflow incorrect? I do my own system builds in a directory tree, such as /usr/obj/DESTDIRs/13_1R-CA72-poud , and then have pourdiere(-devel) null mount such to run its jails in for, in this case, releng/13.1 port building on a main [so: 14] system. So I'd need to investigate some to figure out for sure if there is anything odd about your sequence but the delete and build from scratch I'd expect to automatically do a bootstrap toolchain build and then use that build for the later activity that actually targets releng/12.4 . > >A sequence can be bootstrapped by starting from materials for > >a pre-built release or snapshot of the older user space and > >then update via its internal toolchain. My understanding is > >this is the actively supported way, not building older > >user spaces directly from a newer user space and its > >newer toolchain. > > It appears to me[1] to be building its own toolchain and building within > that. The ports it builds work on the machine it's built for, without > errors about things like ABI etc. I don't do any pre-building, and am > unsure if the poudriere jailbuilding process does anything outside of > the standard build process. > > [1] non-expert in any of this! So it looks to me you are building normal bootstrap toolchains and such via normal procedures. My original note was split in 2 parts: building/using bootstrap toolchains vs. otherwise, with the bulk of the text being just about the "otherwise" case: QUOTE I'm unclear here. Is the goal that a system clang 15+ toolchain can build just the bootstrap toolchain and such that are then used to actually build stable/13? Otherwise I'm unclear on how compatibility with what a system clang 14 toolchain would produce is established. . . . END QUOTE Most anything in the "otherwise" material was not intended to apply to the bootstrap case: very different contexts. By contrast, I was not so worried if building and then using a bootstrap toolchain was the intent (instead of direct use of the newer toolchain for everything). I could not tell which case(s) were the intend coverage for what I was replying to. So, overall, I think that you just went in a different direction than I was trying to go in the "otherwise" part of my original note. === Mark Millard marklmi at yahoo.com