Re: Deprecation of i386 and 32-bit powerpc for 15.0

On Fri, 20 Jun 2025 21:03:51 +0300
Konstantin Belousov <kostikbel@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Fri, Jun 20, 2025 at 10:40:15AM -0700, Cy Schubert wrote:
> > In message <3e998e81-0c3e-4b9a-8bcd-44b9cf70b6d1@FreeBSD.org>, John Baldwin 
> > wri
> > tes:
> > > In February 2023, the FreeBSD core team announced a plan to deprecate
> > > most 32-bit platforms in FreeBSD 15.0.  Since that time, armv6 support
> > > has been removed from main leaving i386 and 32-bit powerpc as the
> > > remaining 32-bit platforms slated for deprecation.  While there have
> > > been a few requests to keep full support for these platforms, we have
> > > not seen an increase in developer interest or willingness to support
> > > these platforms.
> > >
> > > In the past, removing platforms has been a bit messy.  Once a platform
> > > is disconnected in main but remains in older stable branches, there is
> > > a risk of MFCs breaking these deprecated platforms.  That has
> > > certainly been the case with our most recent removal of MIPS (which is
> > > still present in 13).  OTOH, keeping code around in the tree that is
> > > deprecated comes at its own cost, and we would like to find the right
> > > balance for deprecating i386 and 32-bit powerpc in 15.0.
> > >
> > > Prompted by a request from re@, srcmgr@ drafted an initial plan back
> > > in January and shared it with core@.  core@ asked srcmgr@ to drive
> > > this deprecation in coordination with other teams.  srcmgr@ worked
> > > with re@ and portmgr@ to refine the initial plan into the proposal
> > > below.  One request we received during this process is to keep the
> > > full i386 world building even if the kernel is disabled.  Given the
> > > presence of armv7 covering 32-bit warnings for userspace still and
> > > that most MD code for i386 is already required for lib32 builds, the
> > > cost of keeping this building seems relatively minor.
> > >
> > > The proposed timeline:
> > >
> > > - On main 3 months prior to the branching of stable/15 (June 2025):
> > >
> > >    - disable all i386 kernel configs in make universe in main leaving
> > >      i386 as a world-only target in make universe
> > >
> > >    - move 32-bit powerpc out of the default list of targets for
> > >      universe in main
> > >
> > >    - stop building release image snapshots for i386, powerpc, and
> > >      powerpcspe
> > >
> > >    - stop building binary packages for i386 and powerpc for main
> > >
> > >    - disable CI jobs in jenkins for i386 and powerpc
> > >
> > > - On stable/15 after it branches (September 2025):
> > >
> > >    - exclude i386 and powerpc from CI jobs added in jenkins for the new
> > >      branch
> > >
> > >    - do not add package builds or release image builds for i386 and
> > >      powerpc for the new branch
> > >
> > > - ~6 months after branching (BSDCan 2026 devsummit):
> > >
> > >    - evaluate how stable/14 has been fairing (are MFCs breaking
> > >      deprecated platforms) (note that stable/13 will be EOL at this
> > >      point)
> > >
> > >      - if all is smooth, start removing code from main for i386 and
> > >        powerpc kernels as well as any powerpc userspace code not
> > >        required for lib32
> > 
> > When can we expect lib32 removal?
> Hopefully never.

Maybe this could puzzle more persons.

IIUC, lib32 is for running 32bit apps on 64bit platform, which is NOT
planned for removal.

What is going to be deprecated is 32bit bare-metal hardwares supports
for i386 and 32bit PowerPC, which never runs on 64bit modes.


> > >      - if all is not smooth, re-evaluate
> > >
> > > - after the final 14.x release (September 2027):
> > >
> > >    - MFC removals of i386 and powerpc code to stable/15
> > >
> > > Note that until the code for these platforms is actually removed, the
> > > build infrastructure will remain in the tree on both main and
> > > stable/15, and the deprecated targets will still be buildable
> > > manually, for example using `make buildworld TARGET_ARCH=i386`.
> > >
> > > -- 
> > > John Baldwin
> > >
> > 
> > 
> > -- 
> > Cheers,
> > Cy Schubert <Cy.Schubert@cschubert.com>
> > FreeBSD UNIX:  <cy@FreeBSD.org>   Web:  https://FreeBSD.org
> > NTP:           <cy@nwtime.org>    Web:  https://nwtime.org
> > 
> > 			e**(i*pi)+1=0


-- 
Tomoaki AOKI    <junchoon@dec.sakura.ne.jp>